Strongest Possible Attack (of each type)

[AegisCave]

My apologies if this thread already exists (or if this is the wrong place to post lol), a precursory search of the OI forums didn't turn up anything similar to this.

Basically, I'm curious to see what the strongest possible move of each type could be, without stat boosts and obvious stuff like Huge Power.

For example, the strongest Water attack I can come up with is as follows:

Hide

252+, Choice Specs, skill swapped Mega Launcher Origin Pulse in Rain
(skill swapping Mega Launcher to Kyogre makes Origin Pulse even more powerful than Water Spout!)

So, as I mentioned, this thread is dedicated to finding all of the most powerful moves of each type. The rules:

Hide

-Skill Swapping abilities is allowed, other than Huge Power/Pure Power (be creative people)
-Pokemon must maintain its original type (i.e., no Skill Swapping Protean onto stuff to change its type- Mega Rayquaza and Shuckle basically win most of these). The only exceptions are Soak and Forest's Curse (basically no Protean BS)
-Pokemon most learn the move itself (no Mirror Move/Mimic/Metronome)
-Speaking of Metronome (item), the move being calculated must be its first PP expended
-Assume the Atk/SpA of the poke is maxed at 252+ and +6, Helping Hand, etc. Since Flower Gift only applies to physical attacks, list it.
-Don't Power Split stuff lol, that gets really messy.

With all that said, what are the strongest moves you guys can come up with?

Here are a few more ideas to get you started:

Fire:

Hide

With the shiny Rayquaza event came the most absurd move Game Freak has ever created: V-Create.

V-Create backed by Choice Band, a triggered Flash Fire (obtained via Skill Swap), Blaze (SSed after Flash Fire is triggered), Sun, and Flower Gift.

Who needs STAB?

Flying:

Hide

Once again, Mega Ray unleashes its fury upon the universe.

This time, it's CB, SSed Aerilate, and Giga Impact. Interestingly, it could also be Specs Aerilate Hyper Beam as well.

Normal:

Hide

Could easily be a better one than this, buuuut:
CB, SSed Guts (then statused), Giga Impact.

 

[Mq]

My apologies if this thread already exists (or if this is the wrong place to post lol), a precursory search of the OI forums didn't turn up anything similar to this.

Basically, I'm curious to see what the strongest possible move of each type could be, without stat boosts and obvious stuff like Huge Power.

For example, the strongest Water attack I can come up with is as follows:

Hide

252+, Choice Specs, skill swapped Mega Launcher Origin Pulse in Rain
(skill swapping Mega Launcher to Kyogre makes Origin Pulse even more powerful than Water Spout!)

So, as I mentioned, this thread is dedicated to finding all of the most powerful moves of each type. The rules:

Hide

-Skill Swapping abilities is allowed, other than Huge Power (be creative people)
-Pokemon must maintain its original type (i.e., no Skill Swapping Protean onto stuff to change its type- Mega Rayquaza basically wins most of these)
-Pokemon most learn the move itself (no Mirror Move/Mimic/Metronome)
-Speaking of Metronome (item), the move being calculated must be its first PP expended
-Assume the Atk/SpA of the poke is unmodified after maxing (i.e. no Power Split and stat boosts, including from Download)
-Helping Hand could apply in basically every case, so don't worry about listing it.

With all that said, what are the strongest moves you guys can come up with?

Here are a few more ideas to get you started:

Fire:

Hide

With the shiny Rayquaza event came the most absurd move Game Freak has ever created: V-Create.

V-Create backed by max Attack, Choice Band, a triggered Flash Fire (obtained via Skill Swap), Blaze (SSed after Flash Fire is triggered), and Sun.

Who needs STAB?

Flying:

Hide

Once again, Mega Ray unleashes its fury upon the universe.

This time, it's CB, SSed Aerilate, and Giga Impact. Interestingly, it could also be Specs Aerilate Hyper Beam as well.

Normal:

Hide

Could easily be a better one than this, buuuut:
CB, SSed Guts (then statused), Giga Impact.

Wont kyogre be locked onto skill swap while using specs?

 

[Durengardnit]

double battle cb regigigas with a skill swapped huge power + helping hand +6 baton passed atk using explosion should just about do the trick

The rules in the OP state that the Pokémon has to learn the move itself, so no Explosion Regigigas. Also Huge Power (I am assuming Pure Power, too) is excluded from the abilites you can Skill Swap because it´s too easy to just slap Huge Power on any physical attacker.

 

[Codraroll]

I found a stronger Normal move that could be set-up and executed in a single turn in Singles a few years back:

Guts Ursaring holding Choice Band switches into status move, uses Metronome, gets Explosion.

Was more impressive in Gen IV, but I suppose it's still a mightily strong move. Not sure if Slaking's Giga Impact would be stronger, but it takes longer time to set up.

As for Bug, given time to set up: Swarm Escavalier with low HP using Fury Cutter for the fifth time in a row holding a Metronome.

The strongest Psychic move probably involves the move Stored Power, since it has a theoretical maximum Base Power of 860. Not sure which user would be the strongest in a given situation, though.


Regarding modifiers such as boosted attack, Flower Gift and Helping Hand, I think we can exclude those since they could theoretically apply to any attack by any Pokémon. Therefore, they won't have any influence which single move is the strongest. Although Flower Gift only boosts Attack, so its presence would mean that physical moves tend to be stronger than Special ones.

 

[AegisCave]

I found a stronger Normal move that could be set-up and executed in a single turn in Singles a few years back:

You can use as many turns as you want to actually set it up, it just needs to be the move's first use. Primarily because Metronome would always be the strongest item otherwise, though I guess this clause doesn't really make sense anyway since the strongest items after Metronome are basically always gonna be Choice items.

As for Psychic, I was originally thinking Deo-A's Psycho Boost, but you're absolutely correct in saying Stored Power is most certainly the strongest. (and Specs Espeon has the highest SpA out of the Stored Power users). Edited OP so from now on we just assume the things are at +6, 252+ Atk/SpA, have Helping Hand boosts, etc.

Ice is interesting because I think it's actually Avalugg using Ice Ball? None of the Refrigerate Explosions even come close.

Fairy is Pixilate Xerneas using Giga Impact, with Flower Gift and also another Fairy Aura user somewhere on the field.

good lord you can add flower gift to Ray's V-Create ;-;

Wont kyogre be locked onto skill swap while using specs?

Kyogre doesn't get skill swap lol. It would be another mon using it on Kyogre


Anyway, made a bunch of edits to OP to clarify/make this less dumb lol.

 

[sneaky.]

+6 252+ Atk Choice Band Sheer Force Darmanitan Helping Hand Flare Blitz vs. -6 0 HP / 0- Def Snover in Sun: 3753196-4415532 (31276633.3 - 36796100%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Enough to kill poor snover 367961 times.

 

[Martin]

I know that the strongest Rock-type attack can be set up as follows:

1. Bring Shuckle with 31 defense IVs, a bold nature, Contrary, Defense Curl, Power Trick, Shell Smash and Rollout and have a level 1 Combee with 0 HP and Def IVs and a -Def nature in the back of the opposing party
2. Use Defense Curl
3. Use Shell Smash until you hit +6 Def followed by Power Trick to invert offensive and defensive stats
4. Use Rollout
5. Ensure that Combee is on the other side of the field on the final hit
6. +6 252+ Atk Shuckle Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Combee: 84180-99036 (49517.6 - 58256.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO (substitutions made to account for the setup)

If I've missed a step please tell me.

 

[Lego]

I know that the strongest Rock-type attack can be set up as follows:

1. Bring Shuckle with 31 defense IVs, a bold nature, Contrary, Defense Curl, Power Trick, Shell Smash and Rollout and have a level 1 Combee with 0 HP and Def IVs and a -Def nature in the back of the opposing party
2. Use Defense Curl
3. Use Shell Smash until you hit +6 Def followed by Power Trick to invert offensive and defensive stats
4. Use Rollout
5. Ensure that Combee is on the other side of the field on the final hit
6. +6 252+ Atk Shuckle Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Combee: 84180-99036 (49517.6 - 58256.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO (substitutions made to account for the setup)

If I've missed a step please tell me.

You could trick it a Choice Band, and if you're not in Singles then you can get a Flower Gift boost from an allied Cherrim. Oh and you forgot to score a critical hit, as well.

 

[Martin]

You could trick it a Choice Band, and if you're not in Singles then you can get a Flower Gift boost from an allied Cherrim. Oh and you forgot to score a critical hit, as well.

Yeah I'll do them in school 'cause getting access to all the info on an ipad is infuriating due to tabs constantly refreshing themselves. I forgot to make Combee level 1 in my calc too, as well as forgetting about Helping Hand, which Cherrim can use. I'll have Huge Power skill-swapped in a chain via Audino too.

 

[stage7_4]

Are we considering fixed damage attacks like Endeavor, or does it not even matter?

Also are we considering pokemon using moves they can't normally have through Mimic, Metronome, Copycat, Mirror Move, or Me First?

Or reflected attacks like a Counter/Mirror Coat (with Sturdy or Focus Sash so it doesn't die before firing it off)?

 

[Dreamox]

No Huge/Pure Power!

 

[lucariomaster2]

Depending on how you see them, OHKO moves like Sheer Cold either do an infinite amount of damage, or they do damage that is exactly equal to the target's remaining HP.

Just food for thought.

 

[Billy the Uncle]

I know that the strongest Rock-type attack can be set up as follows:

1. Bring Shuckle with 31 defense IVs, a bold nature, Contrary, Defense Curl, Power Trick, Shell Smash and Rollout and have a level 1 Combee with 0 HP and Def IVs and a -Def nature in the back of the opposing party
2. Use Defense Curl
3. Use Shell Smash until you hit +6 Def followed by Power Trick to invert offensive and defensive stats
4. Use Rollout
5. Ensure that Combee is on the other side of the field on the final hit
6. +6 252+ Atk Shuckle Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Combee: 84180-99036 (49517.6 - 58256.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO (substitutions made to account for the setup)

If I've missed a step please tell me.

You could give Combee -6 Defense, but I don't think Shuckle has a way to do that by itself. Then again, if Combee needs to be sent out on the last hit of Rollout, then it's pretty impossible to also lower its defenses.

Also 0 HP/Def IVs for the poor sacrificial bee and Metronome to power up the consecutive hits.

EDIT1: Didn't see you specified the 0 IVs already.

As far as Special Psychic goes, I think the most powerful attack would be a full-fledged Stored Power from Soul Dew Latios with +6 in all stats (thus making Stored Power 860 BP), with Helping hand and all the usual helps if in a double/triple battle.

EDIT2: Metronome would give it a 100% boost on the 5th hit, instead of the 50% boost of Soul Dew.

 

[Martin]

You could give Combee -6 Defense, but I don't think Shuckle has a way to do that by itself. Then again, if Combee needs to be sent out on the last hit of Rollout, then it's pretty impossible to also lower its defenses.

Also 0 HP/Def IVs for the poor sacrificial bee and Metronome to power up the consecutive hits.

EDIT1: Didn't see you specified the 0 IVs already.

Rollout targets a random target in double battles, so in theory it could hit Combee's partner on turns 1-4 and hit Combee on turn 5 and have Shuckle's partner lower the Combee's defense stat to -6. Maximise the chance of Shuckle not targetting Combee before turn 5 by putting them on opposite sides of the field in triples and giving both partners Ally Switch to move it to the centre of the field on turn 4 and to Helping Hand on turn 5, giving a 0% chance to target Combee on turns 1-3 and a 33.333...% chance to target it on turns 4-5 (bringing it up to a 55.555...% chance to target it on a single turn). So it would be set up like this:

Things to maximise ease in setting up

Shuckle @ Metronome
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 Def
Bold Nature
- Defense Curl
- Shell Smash
- Power Trick
- Rollout

Audino @ Audinite
Ability: Healer
EVs: 228 Spe
- Simple Beam
- Skill Swap

Diggersby
Ability: Huge Power
- Leer

Combee
Ability: Honey Gather
- Sweet Scent

Cherrim @ Heat Rock
Ability: Flower Gift
- Sunny Day
- Helping Hand

Mew
Ability: Synchronise
- Ally Switch
- Helping Hand

If I forgot anything in that setup please point me out on it.

Anyway, I finally got around to doing the calc and this is what I got:

Or if you want a more user-friendly calc, this is what it would look like:

+6 252+ Def Power Tricked Huge Power Flower Gift Metronome Shuckle Helping Hand Helping Hand Defense Curl Rollout (5th hit) vs. Level 1 -6 0 HP / 0- Def / 0 HP IV / 0 Def IV Combee on a critical hit: 68179380-80211035 (6198125.45455 - 7291912.27273%) -- guaranteed OHKO

I might have gotten the mechanics of Metronome wrong (I'm not sure if it will have reached a 100% or 80% BP increase on the last Rollout), but if I did simply replace one of the 2s in the "320*2*2" bracket with a 1.8 and re-do the calculation.

 

[AegisCave]

Are we considering fixed damage attacks like Endeavor, or does it not even matter?

Also are we considering pokemon using moves they can't normally have through Mimic, Metronome, Copycat, Mirror Move, or Me First?

Or reflected attacks like a Counter/Mirror Coat (with Sturdy or Focus Sash so it doesn't die before firing it off)?

I can't imagine a situation where Endeavor is stronger than anything else, but sure lol. And no, as stated in the OP the mon must learn the move itself.

lucariomaster2 as I understand it, the actual game mechanics themselves just deal damage equal to the mons' remaining HP, so the most damage it could do is as much as Blissey has with max HP (700-something?).

 

[noobcubed]

Time to revive this thread since it seems interesting. It seems that Flower Gift means nearly all the strongest attacks are physical

Normal: Lickilicky, Explosion, Choice Band, Guts, Flower Gift: 295*250*1.5*1.5*1.5*2.5 = 373359. Despite an unpromising 85 Attack stat, this is stronger than Slaking's Giga Impact, Snorlax's Self-Destruct or any other Explosion user.

Grass: Breloom, Bullet Seed (5 hits), Choice Band, Guts/Technician, Flower Gift: 394*125*1.5*1.5*1.5*1.5 = 249328. Edges out Forest Curse Deoxys-A's Grass Knot because it can receive a Flower Gift boost.

Fire: Rayquaza-Mega, V-Create, Choice Band, Flash Fire, Guts, Flower Gift, Sun: 504*180*1.5*1.5*1.5*1.5*1.5 = 688905. Even without STAB this is just a little bit stronger than Victini's equivalent.

Water: Rayquaza-Mega, Waterfall, Choice Band, Soak, Guts, Flower Gift, Rain: 504*80*1.5*1.5*1.5*1.5 = 306180.

Bug: Escavalier, Megahorn, Choice Band, Guts, Flower Gift: 246037.

Might do some more later. Need to sleep now.

 

[LightningLord2]

My entry for Steel:

+6 252+ Atk Sand Force Mega Steelix Helping Hand Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. -6 0 HP / 0- Def Whimsicott in Sand on a critical hit: 2312102-2720124 (19267516.6 - 22667700%) -- guaranteed OHKO

-Steelix is at -6 Speed and paralyzed
-Steelix is affected by Power Trick to get 230 Base Attack
-Whimsicott is at max speed, Level 1, +6 and wields a Choice Scarf to make Gyro Ball hit 150 BP

EDIT: Using Cottonee instead doesn't actually make the attack any stronger.

 

[Codraroll]

^Steelix can't legitimately learn Power Trick, though. It's an attack the user uses on itself, to swap its own Attack and Defense.

Also, when looking that up, I found out that Aegislash can learn Power Trick. That's a strategy with, uh, a fantastically situational use.

 

[AegisCave]

^Steelix can't legitimately learn Power Trick, though. It's an attack the user uses on itself, to swap its own Attack and Defense.

Also, when looking that up, I found out that Aegislash can learn Power Trick. That's a strategy with, uh, a fantastically situational use.

with Stance Change wouldn't that just makes Aeg use it's lower Defense since it'd be in blade forme?

-Whimsicott is at max speed, Level 1, +6 and wields a Choice Scarf to make Gyro Ball hit 150 BP

wouldn't Carbink or something else 4x weak to Steel make the attack stronger?

Time to revive this thread since it seems interesting.
Water: Rayquaza-Mega, Waterfall, Choice Band, Soak, Guts, Flower Gift, Rain: 504*80*1.5*1.5*1.5*1.5 = 306180.

Ray gets Aqua Tail, which is stronger. Also Flower Gift can't be triggered in Rain, so Kyogre wins this one.

 

[noobcubed]

^Derp, of course I forgot about Flower Gift.

Also Slaking's Flail is the strongest Normal-type attack - significantly stronger than any Explosion.

 

[LightningLord2]

Steelix can totally copy Power Trick with Mimic.

Carbink is too slow for Steelix to reach 150 BP with Gyro Ball and Cottonee doesn't take more damage from it, even if its stats are lower.

Also, strongest Psychic attack would be Deoxys-A skill swapping itself Flare Boost while burned firing off a +6 Psycho Boost crit onto a -6 Level 1 Croagunk.

 

[Codraroll]

Also, strongest Psychic attack would be Deoxys-A skill swapping itself Flare Boost while burned firing off a +6 Psycho Boost crit onto a -6 Level 1 Croagunk.

Stronger than an 860 BP Stored Power by Specs Latios after being Baton Passed +6 boosts in every stat?

 

[LightningLord2]

+6 252+ SpA Choice Specs Flare Boost Latios Helping Hand Stored Power (860 BP) vs. -6 0 HP / 0- SpD Croagunk on a critical hit: 29394712-34582020 (244955933.3 - 288183500%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Okay, that works I guess.

Dark is a little unintuitive, since Punishment doesn't yield that many results:

+6 0 Atk Choice Band Huge Power Poochyena Helping Hand Foul Play vs. -6 0 HP / 0- Def Dark Aura Deoxys-A: 492288-579168 (204268.8 - 240318.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Only Choice Band, attack boosting items, STAB and Helping Hand seem to buff the user of Foul Play - Deoxys-A was hit by Trick-Or-Treat and grabbed Yveltal's ability via Skill Swap. Doesn't matter who uses Foul Play as long as it is a Dark-Type.

EDIT: I need to point out that any Pokémon can approach Base 230 Attack with the help of Shuckle using Power Trick + Power Split.

EDIT2: Suggesting a rule change to make the calcs easier and the rules clearer: The battle takes place in a 1v1 environment, which mean both the target and the attacker need to set up everything themselves (note that this does allow anything banned prior such as Protean and Huge Power).

EDIT3:

Submitting the Steel attack under my new Ruleset:

Attacker:

Steelix @ Steelixite
252 Atk
Nature: Brave
IVs: 0 Spe
Ability: Sturdy->Sand Force
-Curse
-Screech
-Sandstorm
-Gyro Ball

Defender:

Whimsicott @ Choice Scarf
252 Spe
Nature: Hasty
Level 2
IVs: 0 Def
Ability: Prankster
-Stun Spore

Steelix uses 6 Curses and 3 Screeches, then sets up Sandstorm and OHKOes with a Gyro Ball crit. Whimsicott only spams Stun Spore to paralyze Steelix.

+6 252+ Atk Sand Force Mega Steelix Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. -6 0 HP / 0- Def Whimsicott in Sand on a critical hit: 959852-1129242 (6399013.3 - 7528280%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Steel: 1129242

 

[DHR-107]

Gyroball is based on the differences in speed of the two mons... A level two whimsicott is not going to be faster than a paralyzed Mega Steelix even with max speed and a choice scarf. I have honestly no idea how you got the above calc.

+6 252+ Atk Mega Steelix Heavy Slam (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Whimsicott: 43758-51480 (291720 - 343200%) -- guaranteed OHKO

In that instance, Heavy Slam does far more damage. That's with the attack ups but no defence downs on Whimsicott. In this instance, you'd also deal far more damage vs Amaura as it's quad weak to Steel.

+6 252+ Atk Sand Force Mega Steelix Heavy Slam (120 BP) vs. -6 0 HP / 0- Def Amaura in Sand on a critical hit: 1535772-1806792 (12798100 - 15056600%) -- guaranteed OHKO

 

[Fluke]

This thread really amazes me. When thinking about this I always just thought about SD/NP x6 with STAB and Choice Band/Specs. But things as Abilitiy/Speed/Skill Swap etc. really made me realize how awesome this topic is.