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NOC Why is there a gun in my popcorn? GAME OVER SCUM WIN
- Thread starter Panic Station
- Start date
- Status
i also want fh to make a detailed post with his reads thoughts strategy wrt flyhn's plan in case whoever he shoots flips town and doesnt just FREE US FROM THIS
BEFORE he shoots pls
too many gunbearers yoloing off with these unfinished, unexplained threads. see: haruno, twin . . what did they see that would've been relevant in this situation that is lost to their post-hatesex pillowtalk
BEFORE he shoots pls
too many gunbearers yoloing off with these unfinished, unexplained threads. see: haruno, twin . . what did they see that would've been relevant in this situation that is lost to their post-hatesex pillowtalk
Asek
Banned deucer.
ill do this tomorrow morning, i got distracted by pokemon tonight
Asked to put in work and effort after avoiding it for so long :(
Anyways, I don't necessarily agree with flyhns plan as currently I believe walrein to be the best shot. However, there are two shots after mine before we lose so worse case, it is going to come to a 50/50
Will post actual reads soonish
Anyways, I don't necessarily agree with flyhns plan as currently I believe walrein to be the best shot. However, there are two shots after mine before we lose so worse case, it is going to come to a 50/50
Will post actual reads soonish
thats an interesting proposition and a valid one fmpov since the shot order of the other 3 doesn't actually matter much, as long as i am unshot. i know 1 of the 3 is scum so we will win in either 1, 2 or 3 shots
that said i do prefer shooting between asek and blazade bc i think 1 of them is much more likely to be mafia than walrein; solidifying that 5% it's not walrein does sound appealing
ill make another post analyzing scumrein and townrein reasons
that said i do prefer shooting between asek and blazade bc i think 1 of them is much more likely to be mafia than walrein; solidifying that 5% it's not walrein does sound appealing
ill make another post analyzing scumrein and townrein reasons
the walrein slot has been subbed twice, first martin who had MAYBE 1 post, i think 0, and then in came dle who made less than 10 posts total and was also subbed
this slot was subbed at the same time as josh, an active poster, and fort, an idling cuck, both mafia. fort had been making SOME posts but i think his scumteam could've been helping script them especially knowing josh/us/ag were on it.
dle and fort were clearly activity subs but josh could've been a ragequit if 2 of his teammates went mia, sam was inactive af and both he and ag were making bad posts.
or josh could've been unrelated, dle and fort weren't on the same team, koc just finally got 2 (3) subs for inactives.
now that we have more flips, something to note about unclesam's play is he would show up to 'defend' a villager. twin called him for this with flyhn and walrein called him for this with fh, both flipped town. sam got bussed by his scumbuddies but then, like asek, has no reason to BE townread himself as the game goes on. it makes sense early because his hypocritical posts are a hallmark of his town game and i know he had to go into work every day while i visited him irl so he was busy, but as the game goes on there is 0 reason to tr his posts which were just Bad and lacked his usual reasoning. this reflects poorly on both blazade and asek.
then we look at his final hour: he engages into a fight with walrein.
note that previously sam would defend town, possibly to create a false scumpartner look or pocket people. sam hard scumread dle for his scum meta early on, in line with his team's strat of bussing each other. he kept that up all game.
a point in townrein's favor is that the rest of the scumteam didn't really go hard on the slot like they did on sam. but they may have just not wanted to be too conspicuous.
anyway, the fight. sam and walrein haven't really had much engagement all game until then. sam had been idling most of the game and been getting townread for it, so why does he show up when people are pushing for a moody or fh shot and then have this thing with walrein?
sam is a pretty combustible noc player so if he was going to make a Big Play it would absolutely be a fight. they get into it to make them look like they would never be teammates together, because why would they? this is some srs WIFOM though but it is Pretty Convenient that walrein, also pretty dang inactive since subbing in, suddenly perks up in activity and so does sam to get into it with him. sam has been bussed by his teammates all game so if he gets shot within the next 1-2 shots of that fight, walrein looks super clean.
the alternative is it was just a TvS callout by walrein onto garbage unclescum posts that deserved it. i think this is more likely, but the fact that both showed up at the same time to exchange some Words when sam had no reason to post getting tr for idling gives me pause.
the walrein slot has been grouped with blazade in sam's reads whereas asek has been separated which is a point in favor of townrein/zade and scum asek. there has been debate over whether iDLE is scum or town meta for him; he's done it as both alliances which makes it a bit harder to say but i do think it's more in line with his mafia play to toss out a few spicy posts with no reasons; also to do some sort of gametalk IE the 1 town win
with that in mind, the sam v walrein spat could've been a setup to push walrein into the position of lock town when sam inevitably got shot.
i think the theory that dle was scum trying to get a scumbuddy into the lock town spot when he mentioned that idea is very weakened by the flyhn and leet town flips. there is room for it in the scumteam of sam/josh/dle/prob ag too who would feel confident if they could get into a f3 with flyhn mainly or leet, even if they were unable to push their own teammate into that slot. we will never know what dle's strategy on that would've been because he kind of almost never posted again after suggesting it. i'd put it as way more likely dle was just town trying to find the free win strat for this point.
maybe martin just straight didnt post in scumchat so his team didnt know if they should bus him like they did sam after sam posted in this thread "will be p afk, rl" but i put this as a point in townrein's favor as well.
i wouldnt MIND cleaning walrein because there are some avenues that point to him being sam's partner; they did only get hyphy in that fight after ag went down making them the last two, a big push for one to be cleaned when the other flips scum would be huge towards clinching the game in an otherwise very bad position. but i do think it's way more likely asek or blazade is the last scum.
we'll win regardless so it's up to fh on who he wants to shoot hopefully ending this gd game
this slot was subbed at the same time as josh, an active poster, and fort, an idling cuck, both mafia. fort had been making SOME posts but i think his scumteam could've been helping script them especially knowing josh/us/ag were on it.
dle and fort were clearly activity subs but josh could've been a ragequit if 2 of his teammates went mia, sam was inactive af and both he and ag were making bad posts.
or josh could've been unrelated, dle and fort weren't on the same team, koc just finally got 2 (3) subs for inactives.
now that we have more flips, something to note about unclesam's play is he would show up to 'defend' a villager. twin called him for this with flyhn and walrein called him for this with fh, both flipped town. sam got bussed by his scumbuddies but then, like asek, has no reason to BE townread himself as the game goes on. it makes sense early because his hypocritical posts are a hallmark of his town game and i know he had to go into work every day while i visited him irl so he was busy, but as the game goes on there is 0 reason to tr his posts which were just Bad and lacked his usual reasoning. this reflects poorly on both blazade and asek.
then we look at his final hour: he engages into a fight with walrein.
note that previously sam would defend town, possibly to create a false scumpartner look or pocket people. sam hard scumread dle for his scum meta early on, in line with his team's strat of bussing each other. he kept that up all game.
a point in townrein's favor is that the rest of the scumteam didn't really go hard on the slot like they did on sam. but they may have just not wanted to be too conspicuous.
anyway, the fight. sam and walrein haven't really had much engagement all game until then. sam had been idling most of the game and been getting townread for it, so why does he show up when people are pushing for a moody or fh shot and then have this thing with walrein?
sam is a pretty combustible noc player so if he was going to make a Big Play it would absolutely be a fight. they get into it to make them look like they would never be teammates together, because why would they? this is some srs WIFOM though but it is Pretty Convenient that walrein, also pretty dang inactive since subbing in, suddenly perks up in activity and so does sam to get into it with him. sam has been bussed by his teammates all game so if he gets shot within the next 1-2 shots of that fight, walrein looks super clean.
the alternative is it was just a TvS callout by walrein onto garbage unclescum posts that deserved it. i think this is more likely, but the fact that both showed up at the same time to exchange some Words when sam had no reason to post getting tr for idling gives me pause.
the walrein slot has been grouped with blazade in sam's reads whereas asek has been separated which is a point in favor of townrein/zade and scum asek. there has been debate over whether iDLE is scum or town meta for him; he's done it as both alliances which makes it a bit harder to say but i do think it's more in line with his mafia play to toss out a few spicy posts with no reasons; also to do some sort of gametalk IE the 1 town win
with that in mind, the sam v walrein spat could've been a setup to push walrein into the position of lock town when sam inevitably got shot.
i think the theory that dle was scum trying to get a scumbuddy into the lock town spot when he mentioned that idea is very weakened by the flyhn and leet town flips. there is room for it in the scumteam of sam/josh/dle/prob ag too who would feel confident if they could get into a f3 with flyhn mainly or leet, even if they were unable to push their own teammate into that slot. we will never know what dle's strategy on that would've been because he kind of almost never posted again after suggesting it. i'd put it as way more likely dle was just town trying to find the free win strat for this point.
maybe martin just straight didnt post in scumchat so his team didnt know if they should bus him like they did sam after sam posted in this thread "will be p afk, rl" but i put this as a point in townrein's favor as well.
i wouldnt MIND cleaning walrein because there are some avenues that point to him being sam's partner; they did only get hyphy in that fight after ag went down making them the last two, a big push for one to be cleaned when the other flips scum would be huge towards clinching the game in an otherwise very bad position. but i do think it's way more likely asek or blazade is the last scum.
we'll win regardless so it's up to fh on who he wants to shoot hopefully ending this gd game
That in part is what I think went on, US and Walrein getting into that fight where no matter who was shot, the other one would seem more towny from it. Plus, with final two scum left, there is a lot of temptation I would think to bus each other and try to secure a lock township so that you can coast to the final 3 and hope/control town to misshoot.
Like I said, I don't mind bring shot; I'll just fire into the scummier of blazade/asek and if I'm wrong Yeti can 1v1 whoever's left
That said I'm surprised at how much credit Yeti's giving me when she was able to read me like a book in Dead Mafia and only held off on lynching me because of an inspect falsification
That said I'm surprised at how much credit Yeti's giving me when she was able to read me like a book in Dead Mafia and only held off on lynching me because of an inspect falsification
Asek
Banned deucer.
Walrein -
yeti
Oh and for a completely irrelvant and personal tidbit: dont think its too unlikely yeti and sam request to be on the same team :p
Blazade
Overall - Blazade has such little content compared to yeti and walrein overall that its harder to read him overall. Theres been stuff that looks good, but also some stuff that looks terrible. I think the most important point I can offer you out of this former is the quick josh hopping onto the blazade point I posted - josh also did this to unclesam when people offered him up as a shot, but I dont think this was the case here. I will let you read into that situation as you will. Here is the post.
I think I shoot him before yeti but I know if hes town he shoots me and i dont want to have to pick between a 50/50 of walrein and yeti if it comes down to that.
Former Hope I will let you come to your own conclusions on me but heres my current thought process. If you have any questions to ask me about any of these points feel free to ask me
- I have pointed out previously, I do not partiuclarly like that walrein has picked up his activity so substantially within the last few cycles. There has been nothing to connect this slot to the flips that occured before like... 2 cycles ago, and this leads to, what I consider at least a pretty dangerous slot, with not too much to read on. It also kind of irks me that walrein only started REALLY posting once twin and flyhn, two of the towniest slots in the game had just been shot
- The unclesam vs walrein argument - is it just me or is unclesams tone in his weird apologoy post vastly different from the way he spoke to anyone in the rest of the thread after these kind of altercations? Look at his stance towards twin and myself after we had arguments with him - he didnt back off rather he kept pushing down.
- I didnt like da letter els playstyle whilst he was in the game
- Walreins post that nearly coincided with mine where we shared similar thoughts onto what former hope was posting - could walrein fake the same thing I was thinking as scum? I think it came from a pretty genuinely town perspective. Major town points here from me
- Called moody as more of a town read - think he was one of the people aside from me who said they wouldnt shoot him in the cycle he was going to get shot?
yeti
- posted if moody vs former was tvt we seriously looked at walreins direction - now that this has happened shes pushign harder onto me and blazade?
- In relation to above, also pushing aggressively for moody and former to be shot - these were 2 easy mishots from mafia perspective
- "too many gunbearers yoloing off with these unfinished, unexplained threads. see: haruno, twin . . what did they see that would've been relevant in this situation that is lost to their post-hatesex pillowtalk" - think this could be scum saying this play has historically fucked the game for town thus far, do not do it at this point (taking the BIG MONEY plays), when shooting yeti at this point WOULD be considered that play
- A lot of effort always looks good and more likely to be townie then scum.
- Yeti has kind of an inverse relationship to unclesam that I do - Yeti consistently called unclesam a subpar shot in the early stages of the game, whilst I rallied for him to be shot. Over time I said unclesam was a poorer shot, and yeti started shoving onto him TO be shot.
- Aura guardian was also kinda pushing for unclesam and yeti to be shot all game - I dont really know much about this guys meta. I'll ask Walrein Blazade - is he the kind of player who slots a town and a scum buddy into these kinds of lists?
- Yeti has tried to credit other players as well as solely empoof for pushing for lock town flyhn - I was one of the first and biggest proponents of this as well yet after I corrected yeti here she once again used the same thing here. Feel like theres been a constant effort from yeti to discredit or refuse to acknoledge that I did this
- Yeti also constantly refused to town read flyhn - I felt he was pretty obviously town from my perspective - think its interesting that she kept saying that 'well hes active and active flyhn is mafia'!!! which seemed like a rather vapid reason to scum read him....
- Quite a few flipped town, most noticably a player i respect a lot in twin have town read yeti
Oh and for a completely irrelvant and personal tidbit: dont think its too unlikely yeti and sam request to be on the same team :p
Blazade
- Like walrein - relatively inactive until these last couple of cycles.
- Blazade called FH vs moody tvt - wound up being true.
- Also townread unclesam like me, but more on the basis that wagons supported a town unclesam theory - I could also see this coming from a town blazade perspective. Hes a numbers guy.
- I DO NOT AT ALL LIKE POSTS LIKE THIS SOUNDING HAPPY WHEN A GUNBEARER HAS BEEN SUCCESFUL AND I THINK THEY ARE A SIGN OF SCUM TRYING TO GET TOWN CRED OFF OF NOTHING
- I feel like blazade has scumread me on a rather vapid reasoning - 'im concious of your scumgame'. I could say that about anyone to keep them in shot contention
- I liked that blazade was kind of on moodys side for so long
- Dont like that blazade post way back from when josh was up that rnging the shot was a good idea - but I think it ALSO looks good for him that josh instantly jumped onto that after I posted - I don't think a scum teammate would bus that quickly, especially josh.
- its weird that blazade wanted twin and me shot at relatively early stages of the game
- IVe said this a lot but I expect a lot more from a town blazade then waht I've been expecting - even when I was on vacation I made an effort to check this thread twice a day - I think its not too hard to put in the effort and at least post something no matter how small and provide your 2 cents - I feel like inactivty due to schedule is a cop out at times?
Overall - Blazade has such little content compared to yeti and walrein overall that its harder to read him overall. Theres been stuff that looks good, but also some stuff that looks terrible. I think the most important point I can offer you out of this former is the quick josh hopping onto the blazade point I posted - josh also did this to unclesam when people offered him up as a shot, but I dont think this was the case here. I will let you read into that situation as you will. Here is the post.
I think I shoot him before yeti but I know if hes town he shoots me and i dont want to have to pick between a 50/50 of walrein and yeti if it comes down to that.
Former Hope I will let you come to your own conclusions on me but heres my current thought process. If you have any questions to ask me about any of these points feel free to ask me
we've requested same team in an oc but didnt for this game, normally requesting same team gets you on mafia and i vastly prefer noc as town/we didnt even discuss doing it
some of the stuff you posted about me is just straight wrong, not to mention literally everyone itg has said wrong things.
moody has been one of my top 4 shots for a LONG time and you find it scummy i went and dug up what posts of his made me think so to provide evidence for why i continued to find him likely mafia? idgi.
even your point about blazade's celebration shot post, moody AND ag both had a ton of those WHICH I CALLED as scummy as well, like, i am just ?? that you find me pushing for moody to be shot scummy when he's been my top scumread since the fort flip.
regarding flyhn pushed as town that happened on p25, josh posted right below you in support of dle's idea and you posted right above josh so i think i blurred the two. josh was the one who said he'd be fine taking leet to the end in p631 which i just straight confused, asek and josh blurred together for me hardcore in the early half of the game. i wasnt pushing any narrative or trying to discredit anything i just didnt remember which 1 pushed which dude.
regarding not town reading flyhn that's straight a lie, like 100% genuine lie. flyhn has been at the bottom of my shotlist for most of the game. i do think that his greatest instance of activity in a game with me was dbz where he was neut and normally he idles to high heavens so i was suspicious (he idles in oc games too ive been on his mf team when he posts 0 times in his team pm rly annoying) what was motivating him to post so much, however i've said he would be a garbage shot barring some certain flips that create a very likely scumteam for him to be on, for p much all of the game.
literally go back and read my shot list posts to see flyhn in the bottom grouping, MAYBE second to last, every time.
if flyhn's town noc meta is to idle how is it vapid to say "i dont think activity is his town meta so im suspicious" ??? some of your points dont even make sense
ill review the other 2 l8r going 2 class now
some of the stuff you posted about me is just straight wrong, not to mention literally everyone itg has said wrong things.
moody has been one of my top 4 shots for a LONG time and you find it scummy i went and dug up what posts of his made me think so to provide evidence for why i continued to find him likely mafia? idgi.
even your point about blazade's celebration shot post, moody AND ag both had a ton of those WHICH I CALLED as scummy as well, like, i am just ?? that you find me pushing for moody to be shot scummy when he's been my top scumread since the fort flip.
regarding flyhn pushed as town that happened on p25, josh posted right below you in support of dle's idea and you posted right above josh so i think i blurred the two. josh was the one who said he'd be fine taking leet to the end in p631 which i just straight confused, asek and josh blurred together for me hardcore in the early half of the game. i wasnt pushing any narrative or trying to discredit anything i just didnt remember which 1 pushed which dude.
regarding not town reading flyhn that's straight a lie, like 100% genuine lie. flyhn has been at the bottom of my shotlist for most of the game. i do think that his greatest instance of activity in a game with me was dbz where he was neut and normally he idles to high heavens so i was suspicious (he idles in oc games too ive been on his mf team when he posts 0 times in his team pm rly annoying) what was motivating him to post so much, however i've said he would be a garbage shot barring some certain flips that create a very likely scumteam for him to be on, for p much all of the game.
literally go back and read my shot list posts to see flyhn in the bottom grouping, MAYBE second to last, every time.
if flyhn's town noc meta is to idle how is it vapid to say "i dont think activity is his town meta so im suspicious" ??? some of your points dont even make sense
ill review the other 2 l8r going 2 class now
will reply in depth to asek et. al. later
but if you want my honest opinion my gut thinks that blazade's activity levels are a huge red flag when compared with what he normally manages
i honestly think he's just first time NOC mafia struggling to produce content
but if you want my honest opinion my gut thinks that blazade's activity levels are a huge red flag when compared with what he normally manages
i honestly think he's just first time NOC mafia struggling to produce content
Asek
Banned deucer.
sentence 1 is ireelvant
paragraph 2 is your opinion that im wrong - i obviouslt expected this
paragraph 3 - you provide that moody was in your top 4 shots for a long time yeah whatever he was the same for me. After aura guaridan flipped he was NOT in my top shots. You yourself said at some point that you need to constantly re evaluate your shots at town. Why did you not do so after In my opinion the aura guaridan shot made it that much more unlikely that moody would be scum
paragraph 4 doesnt make much sense to me, the 2 sentences are unrelated
paragraph 5 - i corrected you the FIRST TIME YOU DID IT. I quoted you and everything. How did you go on to do the same thing again? I dont believe that you arent paying attention considering the walls youve wrote
paragraph 6 - is this or is this not basically scum reading flyhn it reads very much in that manner for me with a fair bit of hedging around it
Yeah you can say b-b-bb--b-b--bbut i said the idlers come first! I do not view proposing shooting idlers as alignment indicative in most cases and especially not in this format
http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...gunbearer-former.3599297/page-39#post-7302731
This wouldn't be the first time I was mafia in a NOC and believe me I could churn out some bullshit if I needed to.
It's no more and no less than I care a lot more about Paper Mario right now, and I'm not gonna try and say something for the sake of saying it if my opinions don't change. Scum will steer the town shooters to go the wrong way by corrupting public opinion, they'll try to make preflip connections, and that's about all they can do outside of trying to survive to the end. At this point I trust Former to make the call he's gonna make.
that post is scumreading flyhn if 2+ of twin/dle/josh are mafia. I haven't lock townread anyone this game if that's your complaint about flyhn.
I don't think ag being scum made moody less likely to be scum. esp bc they did the same "yay good shot" noise as each other.
sentence 1 is irrelevant but a direct response to a point you brought up?? I get you were trying to be cheeky not serious with it but it's frankly a pretty scummy avenue to bring up to scumread someone is if they requested to be on a team with their s/o or not. I just wanted to play a game, I'm not even sure if koc would've taken requests, but suggesting it off-hand after an entire game of nobody mentioning it rings suspicious.
your read conclusions seem really ambiguous, i'm the middle of the road shot but you "think" you shoot blazade before me? i'm either your second shot or your first if walrein is your third, if middle of the road = second why are you so hesitant to say you'd shoot blazade first, for sure?
I agree that walrein's rise in activity as the numbers ticked down is something to raise eyebrows at, that slot was worthless all game outside of dle's lock town suggestion. if he is town its annoying, along with blazade, to get jack diddly out of them for most of the game. I can appreciate asek at least trying to stay up to date while on vacation, blazade's just been active lurking without reason.
blazade not posting all game is just zzz, the dude has a lot more to contribute if he's town and normally I paranoidread him bc I see him as competent and a threat if mafia but he's always been town, this game he's just done nothing. I think after the flounder where he kept believing he was town in Amnesiac, as scum, he's just not sure how to feign it as mafia when his towngame is so wordy. that he says he's keeping up with it when walrein expressed concern about blazade being the last gunbearer but has still not really been participating here is like, i'm over it. mad over. if you're keeping up then help the town out.
I don't think ag being scum made moody less likely to be scum. esp bc they did the same "yay good shot" noise as each other.
sentence 1 is irrelevant but a direct response to a point you brought up?? I get you were trying to be cheeky not serious with it but it's frankly a pretty scummy avenue to bring up to scumread someone is if they requested to be on a team with their s/o or not. I just wanted to play a game, I'm not even sure if koc would've taken requests, but suggesting it off-hand after an entire game of nobody mentioning it rings suspicious.
your read conclusions seem really ambiguous, i'm the middle of the road shot but you "think" you shoot blazade before me? i'm either your second shot or your first if walrein is your third, if middle of the road = second why are you so hesitant to say you'd shoot blazade first, for sure?
I agree that walrein's rise in activity as the numbers ticked down is something to raise eyebrows at, that slot was worthless all game outside of dle's lock town suggestion. if he is town its annoying, along with blazade, to get jack diddly out of them for most of the game. I can appreciate asek at least trying to stay up to date while on vacation, blazade's just been active lurking without reason.
blazade not posting all game is just zzz, the dude has a lot more to contribute if he's town and normally I paranoidread him bc I see him as competent and a threat if mafia but he's always been town, this game he's just done nothing. I think after the flounder where he kept believing he was town in Amnesiac, as scum, he's just not sure how to feign it as mafia when his towngame is so wordy. that he says he's keeping up with it when walrein expressed concern about blazade being the last gunbearer but has still not really been participating here is like, i'm over it. mad over. if you're keeping up then help the town out.
Asek
Banned deucer.
Fair point about the sam point I probably shouldnt have bought it up
my conclusions are basically saying I dont shoot walrein today. If former hope said to me 'HEY ASEK WHO DO I SHOOT BLAZADE OR YETI' i say blazade. But I've laid out what I think so he can see what I really think
my conclusions are basically saying I dont shoot walrein today. If former hope said to me 'HEY ASEK WHO DO I SHOOT BLAZADE OR YETI' i say blazade. But I've laid out what I think so he can see what I really think
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