Ninjask

[Kindrindra]

Erufuun: Shit defences, poor attack, and walled by grass types (no U-turn doesn't count)

I've used Erufuun, and I can safely say you're underestimating it. Poor attack doesn't matter, as most Erufuun I've seen (including mine) run NO attacking moves. Likewise, poor defenses are patched up somewhat by Max investment Defense, and almost completly bypassed by MH Substitute. Erufuun can cause limitless mind games- If you get a Sub up, get a turn without it breaking, and your opponent is out of grass-types, they'll be hard pressed to stop Lefties+Sub+Leech Seed. Nattetori is Erufuun's absolute bane, however. Well, for the most part. If he comes out while you're behind a sub, you can Taunt as he breaks your sub (or doesn't, which is even better for you), then procced to do as you wish. If you're wondering what I run, Substitute/Leech Seed/Encore/Taunt is amazing. Hell, I've even outlasted Shadow Tag Chandelure with it.

And that's just Erufuun. Sableye gets priority RECOVER. If I'm not drastically mistaken, I think Sub/Recover/Will-o-wisp/Taunt is the most common Sableye set?


Oh, yeah. Don't forget that Voltos gets MH, too. And the pure-flying genie too, I'm pretty sure.

 

[cosmicexplorer]

Yay for sweeping with 90 base attack and terrible coverage. If only. Ninjask is pretty worthless outside of passing to other pokes

Hate to say it, but he's right.

Particularly when there's Speed Boost Blaziken to be using.

He was being sarcastic...

 

[Dragon Rider]

Anybody try a Life Gamble set?Something like:

Ninjask @ Leftovers/Focus Sash
Adamant 252 HP/252 Atk/6 Spe
- Life Gamble
- Baton Pass
- Swords Dance/X-Scissor
- Protect/X-Scissor

Mostly a standard BP set with a move that can possibly cripple a Pokemon.With max HP, Ninjask reaches 326 HP.While not enough to directly KO most Pokemon, it will still take a nice chunk out of them.Afterwards, just bring in your counter and finish them off.Possibly getting rid of any phazer they might have (for instance, Skarmory at max health has 334 HP.This would mean a full health Skarmory would be left with 8 HP.) or possibly just a counter to one of your pokes.This is also beneficial since there are a lot more bulky tanks/sweepers going aound and Ninjask is faster than everything so you can get it in before getting hit.

If you don't need to Life Gamble, you can go about your Baton Passing business.The speed of this Ninjask,even with no investment, is 357 before a boost and 535 after one.Protect for speed boosts.Swords Dance if you think you can get one in, and X-Scissor if you want an attack that won't sacrifice Ninjask.

The main problems are many.The chief among them is that Life Gamble needs most of the HP intact.Which is a problem due to Ninjask's SR weakness and the fact he dies or gets severly hurt through almost any priority attack.The fact that Life Gamble doesn't work on Ghosts is another problems.

 

[gabezj]

you should slash sub somewhere if you want to baton pass more effectively

 

[Siegrin]

i was hoping for the day when Ninjask would receive Taunt! Damn its not this gen. Ninjask would seriously improve so much if it could prevent phazers, and it'd be the best baton passer out there, no doubt.

 

[Pombo]

except that, this time, phazers arent ninjask's nightmares. MH users are. Of course, phazers are a pain in the a**, but can be dealt with.

Also, for the sole reason of not being stopped cold by MH/Phazers (and, by killing/weakening them doing a GREAT favor for the team), I think Dragon Rider's moveset is the best.

 

[cosmicexplorer]

you should slash sub somewhere if you want to baton pass more effectively

He's using Life Gamble.

Dragon Rider, that set doesn't look half bad. Life Gamble does do a surprising amount to Skarmory and whatnot, even after SR.

 

[gabezj]

He's using Life Gamble.

He still has BP on that set as well as stuff to BP and he mentioned that it plays like a normal BPer, therefore sub should be an option at the very least.

 

[Cshadow]

But it's a Life Gamble set. It'll lose it's effectiveness in conjunction with Substitute.

 

[gabezj]

I see how it takes power away from life gamble, however the user doesnt have to use the move if they dont feel like it will benefit themselves. If the user decides they would rather get some extra boosts in to BP as opposed to using LG, they have that option but they are not forced to use that option. while it can be harmful to the set's goals, it can also be beneficial and the user can decide which and then decide to use that move or not.

 

[cosmicexplorer]

The user can choose to use a set and then use a move on that set that utterly destroys any usefulness it might have had, true. But generally, it's better to use moves that don't make the set you're using completely pointless after using them. If you're going to use Substitute, don't use Life Gamble, use another BP set.

 

[gabezj]

With sub, all you get is more options. you dont make the entire set useless, you only make one of its possible options weaker while assisting another one of its options. Again, if getting a few extra boosts is more useful than doing damage to a target, you can do that and if not, having sub available does you no harm.

 

[PokéMontage]

The point is, if you're going to bother using an unorthodox surprise move like Life Gamble, you probably shouldn't do anything to screw it up. Otherwise, you might as well simply use the standard set.

 

[gabezj]

Bump. Now that tiers are more sorted out than when this discussion was more active, how do you all feel Ninjask fairs compared to other baton passers in RU and how viable do the rest of you feel Ninjask is?