bugmaniacbob
Was fun while it lasted
Order of Operations
Portrait of an Uber
Suspect Stages:
3 questions to be addressed before we begin:
Correct me if I have missed anything, I have compiled a list of aspects of Pokemon that have been banned or are close to banned at this point in time:
Murkrow
Yanma
Tangela
DeepSeaTooth
Meditite
Gligar
Misdreavus
(Berry Juice)
Scyther and Sneasel are, as I am sure you are aware, absent from this list; I imagine that there are very few members who would seriously advocate their testing. Berry Juice is in brackets, since it is perhaps the most controversial suspect on the list, and is also difficult to test in the same manner as a Pokemon would be. Therefore, if it is to be tested afterwards, there is no reason to include it for the forseeable future.
A list of things that should be completed before Suspect testing can be considered:
1. The Suspect Stages, Definition, Critical Ratio and Characteristics of an Uber should be discussed to determine whether they hold true for Little Cup, and should they prove false, be rewritten.
Here is the crucial point - Suspects in Little Cup are still not, at this point, defined by any written means. Testing simply cannot be contemplated until this is sorted out. Hell, we may decide that it is too much hassle to test all the suspects in isolation, and just go straight to Stage 3, but I don't have an opinion in that respect at this point.
2. The suspects need to be decided upon, ordered in degrees of importance, and confirmed as a course of action.
This bit is pretty self-explanatory, as those that are worthy of testing, or simply cannot be considered to have been voted Uber based on definable characteristics and according to Smogon's ruling.
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To start off the discussion:
Personally I think that the Suspect Definition, Stages and Critical Ratio can all stay the same as their counterparts for OU and UU, given that Little Cup is not radically different in that area. On the subject of the Suspect Clauses, I cannot see defensive clause as being necessary, given the overall offensive nature of the metagame. Even if there is a Pokemon pre-evo introduced in generation 4 that can actually wall most of the Little Cup metagame, then surely the support clause can be tweaked to accomodate the defensive aspect in this nature, as this walling is tantamount to weakening the opponent's team in a way that allows another Pokemon to sweep. However, if we're going to be technical here, it is almost as difficult at the other end, to "sweep the majority of teams" at any rate. The only non-Uber Pokemon I can think of that usually function as sweepers at all in Little Cup are DD Dratini and possibly RP Gligar. To be honest, the single support clause could probably suffice for all situations at present: A Pokémon is Uber if, in common battle conditions, it can consistently set up a situation in which it makes it substantially easier for other Pokémon to sweep. Obviously if Berry Juice is allowed and Dratini subsequently tested, the offensive clause would have to come back or else this single clause edited to reflect the change. I would probably put it as: A Pokémon is Uber if, in common battle conditions, it can consistently set up a situation in which it or other Pokémon on its team can defeat the opponent with substantial ease.
As for the Order of Operations:
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Thank you for reading. Comments and Concerns appreciated.
Portrait of an Uber
Suspect Stages:
Suspect Definition:Stage 1: Analysis of a single Suspect in a suspect-free standard metagame.
Stage 2: Our assessment of Uber or OU for any Suspect's impact on a suspect-free metagame, following the respective Suspect's completion of Stage 1.
Stage 3: Analysis of all the Suspects in the standard metagame with the knowledge of which are considered Uber and OU in a Suspect-free metagame.
Uber Characteristics:Suspect: Any Pokémon, move or clause that respectively may benefit competitive standard or uber battle if moved or implemented elsewhere.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Offensive Characteristic
A Pokémon is uber if, in common battle conditions, it is capable of sweeping through a significant portion of teams in the metagame with little effort.
Defensive Characteristic
A Pokémon is uber if, in common battle conditions, it is able to wall and stall out a significant portion of the metagame.
Support Characteristic
A Pokémon is uber if, in common battle conditions, it can consistently set up a situation in which it makes it substantially easier for other Pokémon to sweep.
PLEASE NOTE THAT ANY TESTING IS NOT BEING CONSIDERED TO ACTUALLY TAKE PLACE UNTIL SHODDY BATTLE 2 IS RELEASED. HOWEVER, IN THE INTERESTS OF SMOOTHNESS I WOULD THINK IT HELPFUL IF THIS WERE FINALISED SOONER RATHER THAN LATER. THIS IS ALSO ASSUMING THAT THE LITTLE CUP TIER SHOULD FOLLOW THE SMOGON REGULATIONS FOR THE TESTING OF ANY POSSIBLE SUSPECTS.
3 questions to be addressed before we begin:
- Is the current Little Cup player base sufficient to warrant testing of potential Little Cup Suspects? By which I mean, are we confident that the boost to numbers provided when Shoddy Battle 2 comes out will provide us with an overflow of casual players so as to determine results thoroughly?
- Are the current suspect criteria valid in Little Cup? If they are not, what would be an ideal set of alternative characteristics that could be used? (May require some discussion)
- What are, currently, the Pokemon eligible for possible Suspect testing/retesting?
Correct me if I have missed anything, I have compiled a list of aspects of Pokemon that have been banned or are close to banned at this point in time:
Murkrow
Yanma
Tangela
DeepSeaTooth
Meditite
Gligar
Misdreavus
(Berry Juice)
Scyther and Sneasel are, as I am sure you are aware, absent from this list; I imagine that there are very few members who would seriously advocate their testing. Berry Juice is in brackets, since it is perhaps the most controversial suspect on the list, and is also difficult to test in the same manner as a Pokemon would be. Therefore, if it is to be tested afterwards, there is no reason to include it for the forseeable future.
A list of things that should be completed before Suspect testing can be considered:
1. The Suspect Stages, Definition, Critical Ratio and Characteristics of an Uber should be discussed to determine whether they hold true for Little Cup, and should they prove false, be rewritten.
Here is the crucial point - Suspects in Little Cup are still not, at this point, defined by any written means. Testing simply cannot be contemplated until this is sorted out. Hell, we may decide that it is too much hassle to test all the suspects in isolation, and just go straight to Stage 3, but I don't have an opinion in that respect at this point.
2. The suspects need to be decided upon, ordered in degrees of importance, and confirmed as a course of action.
This bit is pretty self-explanatory, as those that are worthy of testing, or simply cannot be considered to have been voted Uber based on definable characteristics and according to Smogon's ruling.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To start off the discussion:
Personally I think that the Suspect Definition, Stages and Critical Ratio can all stay the same as their counterparts for OU and UU, given that Little Cup is not radically different in that area. On the subject of the Suspect Clauses, I cannot see defensive clause as being necessary, given the overall offensive nature of the metagame. Even if there is a Pokemon pre-evo introduced in generation 4 that can actually wall most of the Little Cup metagame, then surely the support clause can be tweaked to accomodate the defensive aspect in this nature, as this walling is tantamount to weakening the opponent's team in a way that allows another Pokemon to sweep. However, if we're going to be technical here, it is almost as difficult at the other end, to "sweep the majority of teams" at any rate. The only non-Uber Pokemon I can think of that usually function as sweepers at all in Little Cup are DD Dratini and possibly RP Gligar. To be honest, the single support clause could probably suffice for all situations at present: A Pokémon is Uber if, in common battle conditions, it can consistently set up a situation in which it makes it substantially easier for other Pokémon to sweep. Obviously if Berry Juice is allowed and Dratini subsequently tested, the offensive clause would have to come back or else this single clause edited to reflect the change. I would probably put it as: A Pokémon is Uber if, in common battle conditions, it can consistently set up a situation in which it or other Pokémon on its team can defeat the opponent with substantial ease.
As for the Order of Operations:
- Gligar
- Misdreavus
- Tangela
- Meditite
- Yanma
- (Murkrow)
- DeepSeaTooth
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Thank you for reading. Comments and Concerns appreciated.