SM OU A different take on HO

[Armadillian]

I'm somewhat new to competitive battling, and was hoping you could help me develop my team which has been a WIP for a long time. I like the team a lot, but I am not getting the win rates that I would like. Thank you in advance!

Mimikyu @ Fairium Z
Ability: Disguise
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Play Rough
- Shadow Claw
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Sneak

I've become a very big fan of Mimikyu. Its ability is so powerful, just being able to switch into something to take a hit. Mimikyu is also fast, which means that if you know you can outspeed something, you can set up the swords dance basically for free and then attack on the next turn. Shadow sneak provides STAB priority which is very useful, and Fairium Z can take out a lot of strong dragon type threats or just be used to boost the accuracy of play rough if in a pinch.

Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 68 Atk / 188 SpA / 252 Spe
Rash Nature (I know not the best nature but could be worse; this is what I have in game and I don't have the ability to get another)
- Thunderbolt
- Incinerate
- Brick Break
- Nasty Plot

I must admit I mainly just like the design of Thunderous, but in testing I've found that it can be a threat to many pokemon. STAB life orb thunderbolt can be a big problem for flying and water types. Incinerate just adds the surprise factor, as most opponents do not expect it on Thunderous. One boost from nasty plot also makes Thunderous very deadly. I run brick break because of defiant, and again to catch my opponent off guard. This also explains the EV split. Thunderous can also be switched in for Toxapex if there's an incoming earthquake.

Toxapex @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic
- Haze

Toxapex serves, obviously, as a defensive wall. Toxic and recover can be used to stall, along with regenerator. I mainly use scald to try to get the burn, and haze is very important for stopping sweepers in their tracks. Toxapex's EVs and natural bulk prevent it from being OHKOd by nearly anything, including the threatening earthquake and thunderbolt.

Tapu Bulu @ Leftovers
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Careful Nature (Same as Thunderous)
- Leech Seed
- Bulk Up
- Horn Leech
- Brick Break

Bulu is the most recent addition to my team, and through testing I'm not exactly sure if it belongs. It can definitely stall with leftovers and leech seed amidst the presence of grassy terrain, and bulk up makes it a scary defensive and offensive threat. However, I think the main reason Bulu doesn't quite fit on the team is the fact that it is weak to ice, and I already have two other pokemon that are weak to ice.

Houndoom-Mega @ Houndoominite
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flamethrower
- Dark Pulse
- Taunt
- Sludge Bomb

I really like Mega Houndoom, somewhat in the same aspect as Thunderous. I feel that it is underused, but brings a lot to the table with its incredible speed and Sp. Attack. It deals with strong grass and steel threats like Ferrothorn, Skarmory, Tangrowth, and many others. Sludge bomb counters Tapu Fini, a common switch in for Houndoom, and flash fire can be utilized for a switch into a predicted fire type attack.

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Poison Jab
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Outrage

Obviously Garchomp is very popular in the meta, and for good reason. Earthquake deals with a lot of problems, but can at times hurt you if your opponent switches into a flying type because of the choice scarf. Dragon claw is big STAB damage, but I'll use outrage if I need even more damage, as I'll be locked into it anyway. Lastly, poison jab counters the fairy typing.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

 

[Trueblade]

I like this team a lot. But there are things to iron out.

Nothing to say on Mimikyu, moving on.

You may need to change to Therian forme on Thundurus, as it is competitively better. Wait, Incinerate? That's really not much of a check, as it won't surprise much. You also may want to replace Brick Break for Hidden Power: Ice, by the way.

I like Toxic-based stallers, and this is coming from a Steel-type fan. I have a similar Skarmory, so moving on.

Hmm...Interesting design for Bulu. You need to replace Brick Break for Superpower, Bulk up for Swords Dance, Leech Seed for Stone Edge, and either has a Grassium Z, or Rockium Z.

Mega Houndoom isn't the best Pokemon in OU. I'd suggest Mega Charizard and...

Mega-Charizard X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVS: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
-Dragon Dance
-Dragon Claw
-Flare Blitz
-Thunder Punch

Dragon Dance is a good move to use Turn one, then you're free to use the other moves.

I'd be careful with Outrage on Garchomp, considering that it confuses the user afterward. But, I have nothing else to say.


Good luck out there!

 

[earl]

Looking at this team and seeing HO as the label but also seeing a toxapex in it is kind of an oxymoron. But enough on that, let me try to help you a bit.
Firstly, contrary to the above poster, stick with Thundy-I if you're set on using one of the two. Therian form thundy is butts. The brick break choice is really confusing, as you want to take advantage of defiant (i.e. Punishing defog) but you have no hazards of any sort. So either switch to the analysis' Nasty Plot set or go with the listed Mixed set on the analysis (because brick break isn't doing anything, even at +1 from intimidate) if you take my next suggestion.
Now, thapex is great and all, but you're gunning for HO here. So I'd reccomend a change to suicide lead Azelf (for HO) or possibly suicide lead Smeargle (as this team contains a few powerful sticky web abusers+ a defog deterrent in thundy). Either way these hazards will help you with nabbing those KO's and keeping momentum up.
Next, I'd shift bulu's set to max attack max speed SD bulu with grassium Z (as Houndoom conveniently deals with skarmory) to pose more offensive presence (no need to stall with HO) and to better take advantage (if you choose) of sticky web. To make up for this swap Mimikyu's item to life orb (or red card if you're feeling spicy).
Normally I'd tell you to change houndoom to something better like Pinsir but it does form a neat little offensive core with Bulu.
Scarf Chomp is fine, but you definitely need stone edge so you aren't destroyed by Volcarona.

team with changes

Mimikyu @ Life Orb
Ability: Disguise
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Sneak
- Play Rough
- Shadow Claw

Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 68 Atk / 188 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Knock Off
- Superpower
- Hidden Power Ice

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Skill Swap
- Explosion
OR
Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Sticky Web
- Stealth Rock
- Skill Swap
- Taunt

Tapu Bulu @ Grassium Z
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Horn Leech
- Superpower
- Wood Hammer

Houndoom @ Houndoominite
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Fire Blast
- Dark Pulse
- Sludge Bomb

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Stone Edge
- Poison Jab

These changes will make it more akin to HO (or webs, I guess)

 

[Armadillian]

Thank you both very much for the help! I'll adjust my team and begin testing tomorrow :)

 

[PBUH]

Hey! Earlio has said pretty everything there is to be said but even still I'd like to address the "HO" title.

In the form you posted it, this team is probably best defined as BO (Bulky Offense), instead of the HO (hyper offense) you labelled it as.
I find that HO is quite widely misunderstood and underappreciated which is unfortunate cause imo its one of the most fun playstyles if you are willing to put the effort into doing it well.

I find the best way to describe HO's playstyle is by comparing it to something we are all familiar with - stall. With a standard BO team versus stall, in order to win you need to make smart doubles in order to put yourself ahead of your opponent's pokemon who can very easily sponge any momentum you managed to gain. With HO, every game is like this. If you're going to win with a HO team, you need to be ahead of your opponent at all times; reacting not only what they are doing, but also what they will be doing!

Now since this is RMT, let's go over a basic structure for HO teams:

1. suicide lead
2. primary wallbreaker
3. secondary wallbreaker
4. primary sweeper
5. secondary sweeper
6. cleaner

If we look at the updated team Earlio posted, it follows this structure quite nicely! Azelf works as our lead, bulu and thundurus can wallbreak, houndoom and mimikyu function as sweepers while scarf chomp is our cleaner.

Another important thing to consider when building HO is role compression. For example - following the structure i outlined earlier - we choose Tyranitar as a wallbreaker and Excadrill as a sweeper because of the synergy of these two pokemon's abilities. Now, ideally, your opponent will be too pressured to get up their hazards but in case they do, excadrill can function as our team's hazard control by using rapid spin as well as being our sweeper! Other examples of role compression is pokemon that can double as stallbreakers, which usually take the form of offensive taunt or toxic users as well as defog punishers/spinblockers to make sure you can get the most out of the hazards your lead set up.

I hope this helps with your future teambuilding endeavors!

 

[ecozone]

with the introduction of fairies into the mainstream meta as of the past couple games, i'd recommend not using dragon claw and outrage on garchomp, you'd probably want a surprise fire blast/coverage move to throw your opponents off guard which could turn the tides of a battle being that your team is so reliant on your offensive threats

 

[Armadillian]

Hey! Earlio has said pretty everything there is to be said but even still I'd like to address the "HO" title.

In the form you posted it, this team is probably best defined as BO (Bulky Offense), instead of the HO (hyper offense) you labelled it as.
I find that HO is quite widely misunderstood and underappreciated which is unfortunate cause imo its one of the most fun playstyles if you are willing to put the effort into doing it well.

I find the best way to describe HO's playstyle is by comparing it to something we are all familiar with - stall. With a standard BO team versus stall, in order to win you need to make smart doubles in order to put yourself ahead of your opponent's pokemon who can very easily sponge any momentum you managed to gain. With HO, every game is like this. If you're going to win with a HO team, you need to be ahead of your opponent at all times; reacting not only what they are doing, but also what they will be doing!

Now since this is RMT, let's go over a basic structure for HO teams:

1. suicide lead
2. primary wallbreaker
3. secondary wallbreaker
4. primary sweeper
5. secondary sweeper
6. cleaner

If we look at the updated team Earlio posted, it follows this structure quite nicely! Azelf works as our lead, bulu and thundurus can wallbreak, houndoom and mimikyu function as sweepers while scarf chomp is our cleaner.

Another important thing to consider when building HO is role compression. For example - following the structure i outlined earlier - we choose Tyranitar as a wallbreaker and Excadrill as a sweeper because of the synergy of these two pokemon's abilities. Now, ideally, your opponent will be too pressured to get up their hazards but in case they do, excadrill can function as our team's hazard control by using rapid spin as well as being our sweeper! Other examples of role compression is pokemon that can double as stallbreakers, which usually take the form of offensive taunt or toxic users as well as defog punishers/spinblockers to make sure you can get the most out of the hazards your lead set up.

I hope this helps with your future teambuilding endeavors!

Thank you for the clarification, very informational! I will keep these roles in mind during team building.