Sticky Pokemon Direct - 6th June Discussion - Pokemon Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon

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Good Mega Evolutions can be easily identified as those that compensate the lack of an item.

Most good offensive Megas get offensive buffs that no Life Orb can match (and sometimes even Choice items), and sometimes utility can be added to the mix (Gengar, Salamence)

Defensive Megas have a much harder time as it's very difficult to compensate the lack of Leftovers. It takes massive utility to be an actual good defensive Mega, and its name's Sableye.
 

Karxrida

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I'm not too sure about that. If I remember correctly, MegaChomp was actually decently popular as a bulky wallbreaker late in gen 6, particularly on teams with Ttar.
Mega Chomp was never really popular. It was seen as a niche pick and was ranked as C last I checked.
 
Changing the topic back to something actually relevant to this thread, how much speculation is there about the purpose of this new twistable z-ring thing the trailer shows us? The general consensus I've seen is that it has something to do with the Necrozma-Solgaleo/Lunala fusion-ha (along the lines of the DNA Splicer in BW2), but then I've also seen talk of new 'Z-forms' of pokemon, which probably stems from the supposed 'New Pokemon' that the games are supposed to bring. Then I've even seen Ultra Evolution theories, which I'm 95% sure are just memes gone wild but you can never tell these days. Then apparently the Z-Crystal on the z-ring looks like a Zygarde cell, or it's a new special kind of Z-move, or it's a hint about new megas being released, or it's a function where you can fuse Necrozma with any of the 802 pokemon in the franchise. I have no clue what to think about it, and I'm not even sure if any those could even be the actual answer. Thoughts?
 

Codraroll

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Going off on another tangent, it seems like there were no USUM news whatsoever from E3 this year. Judging by the previous three game releases, I think Game Freak won't give us more news for at least a month now. Lately, it has all been a bit of a news drought after the initial announcement. The idea must be that fans are meant to speculate and work up hype, but personally (and from experience in this thread), it seems to fall flat. There is simply nothing to be worked up about, and all we can discuss are unfounded hypotheses. We might as well have been discussing Gen VIII or IX - we know just as little about USUM as we do about those far-future games.
 
I feel like this is the one time Nintendo messed up marketing Pokemon. By announcing both USUM and the Switch Pokemon game at the same time, any hype that USUM would have had got taken away since everyone knows the 3DS is on its last leg.

I don't know which game to be excited about since we know so little about both games. If the Switch game is Gen 8 or even a Pokemon XD style game, I'll be skipping USUM. Sad to say that since it'll be the 1st main Pokemon game I would not have played.

Hopefully we get more info soon but I guess I'll be waiting till next month for info.
 
I feel like this is the one time Nintendo messed up marketing Pokemon. By announcing both USUM and the Switch Pokemon game at the same time, any hype that USUM would have had got taken away since everyone knows the 3DS is on its last leg.

I don't know which game to be excited about since we know so little about both games. If the Switch game is Gen 8 or even a Pokemon XD style game, I'll be skipping USUM. Sad to say that since it'll be the 1st main Pokemon game I would not have played.

Hopefully we get more info soon but I guess I'll be waiting till next month for info.
I don't understand why you would skip USUM ...
 

Pikachu315111

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I don't understand why you would skip USUM ...
Depends what USM will be.

If USB does what BW2 did, provide a unique/continuing story which also adds in new characters, then yeah there's no reason to skip it.

However if it does what Gen IV and prior 3rd versions have done than I can see some deciding to skip over it.

Being this game is described to be taking place in an alternate dimension, we have no idea what route it'll take. Unlike BW2 it isn't a sequel, but that doesn't mean significant changes won't be made as it's essentially another version of Alola (unlike how third version games were just an enhanced version of their region). I am fully expecting those empty lots we saw around Alola to come into play, possibly as Gyms (it can easily be explained that in this dimension Kukui pushed to have the Gyms made first before the Pokemon League, or that the Pokemon League was finished earlier than it was in SM). Now it could just be an enhanced third version (though that's something GF said they don't want to do anymore), but I'm leaning that there's probably going to be some major changes that will affect the story giving a different enough experience (for example, there's really no place in the SM story where Solgaleo & Lunala would get the Necrozma armor, so the story would have to be re-written just for that).

Of course the question can be asked how exactly would this story affect the admittedly loose timeline? "GF doesn't give a mulch about the Pokemon timeline". Eh, mostly true when it comes to developing a new region, but when it comes time to add in references & characters from previous games I think some consideration is given to how the passage of time might have affected some things. In that regard, how would the story of the Gen VII games work if SM and USM take place at the same time but in different dimensions? Would USM's story simply replace SM's story if its just an advanced version of its story or, if they're different stories, would it be left ambiguous what events of SM took place with references & characters referencing both yet not in detail? We already sort of have that, without Z or an Emerald remake the events of XY and ORAS have to be kept vague as only one of the Legendaries were awoken (unless there's an unsaid rule where, when the next games come out, no matter whether there was a third version or not an amalgamation of the previous gen's story does exist which can be referenced if must... course that would be hard to do with Gen V which heavily relied on N and the player each getting a dragon).
 
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I don't understand why you would skip USUM ...
Pretty much what Pikachu said. Competitive battling has gotten stale for me this generation (no triple battles) and the story wasn't that interesting outside Team Skull. If the story is more fusion, I'll pass on that. I'm not paying full price for a couple new Pokemon and a slightly rewritten story.

That being said, if the story changes a lot (new mechanic, aether is actually bad instead of the leadership, team skull are the actual threat) then I'll give it a look. I guess it's more the mechanics (megas, Z-moves) that have deflated my interest in gen 7. I hope they fix some of it in gen 8 but that's me wishing on Jirachi.
 
I agree that it was a bad idea for them to reveal the fact that they are making a future main series game for the Switch when US/UM aren't even released yet. It has no effect on me personally since I will get both US/UM and the Switch game, but I have seen some people on various forums say that they are planning to skip US/UM and wait for the Switch game instead. It doesn't take a lot to get this fandom worked up, for better or worse. This has happened before but on a smaller scale as HG/SS were announced in Japan before Platinum was released in Europe. Since then, it appears that Game Freak and TPCi has learned from their mistakes... but maybe not as much as they should. Though, I hope and believe that those who skip US/UM just because of the Switch game announcement are in a minority.

And since I haven't posted here before, I might as well just say this too. I'm really looking forward to US/UM! My biggest hope for what we would get after S/M were a follow-up either to them or to X/Y, and we got one of those things. I'm definitely getting Ultra Moon on the release date.
 
I don't think it's a mistake myself - after all, while they're both Pokémon; they were announced for different consoles. This isn't like if XY was announced a week after BW2; there's incentive for people to get both.
 
They've announced a new 3DS game plus barely confirmed that they're making something for the Switch which is at least 12 (realistically 15-18 months) away.

What's the mistake?

I echo the sentiment above. The more proper games, the better. Providing this is a proper game, then it is what will guarantee that I get a Switch.
 

Codraroll

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Eh, calling it now: Gen 12 will totally be a thing. We are pretty much guaranteed to get one Pokémon game every 18 months (on average) from here on until the series hits a long streak of unpopularity; we'd be talking multiple consecutive years of truly screwed-up design and marketing decisions. Sonic the Hedgehog hasn't had a good game released in years, nevermind a mainstream popular one, but the series is still profitable by surfing on its popularity in the 90's. Pokémon's popularity is miles above what Sonic ever enjoyed. It will take effort to kill the franchise. Game Freak, Nintendo and TPC will keep milking the cash cow for decades, continuously releasing games until a catastrophe hits. Heck, Sherlock Holmes, Alice in Wonderland, and The War of the Worlds were created in the nineteenth century, and they still see regular releases or adaptions. Frankenstein turns 200 years old next year. Still a cultural icon.

"There will be a Pokémon game released after the one recently announced, and it will be out within two and a half years" is a statement likely to be true for a significant percentage of the next century. If that is enough to make you skip the next game, you might as well quit the franchise already.
 
And besides, people are less interested in Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon after the "Pokemon on Switch confirmed" announcement because we still barely know anything about those games. Once features are announced, interest will spark.

Also, I noticed some comments on the so-called Ultra-Solgaleo and Ultra-Lunala having bad designs. It's kind of... missing the point. They look wrong because they ARE wrong from what little lore we have right now.
 
I'd like to address something I heard earlier in the thread.
Believe me, I want Diamond / Pearl remakes probably more than anyone in this thread (my favorite Pokemon Darkrai is tattooed on me and takes up a large portion of my left arm), but I'm glad we aren't getting them for the 3DS. What's more than likely going to happen is that they're going to be remade on the Switch after the Generation 8 games debut on the switch. It makes sense, and it's the same pattern that they did between the HGSS remakes and the ORAS remakes.

Back to Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon though, I'm honestly super hyped because of how well they pulled off Black 2 / White 2. They have plenty of opportunities here to introduce new megas, new alolan forms, new ultra beasts, new z-moves, new mechanics, etc. The alternative dimension aspect really gives them flexibility.
 
It's nice to see that the hypothetical Sinnoh remakes are not coming to the 3DS, as DPP are still playable on the handheld system. It makes more sense to let them appear on the Switch along with Gen 8.

I'm super hyped for USM due to the way BW2 was successfully pulled off. I bet my munny that the postgame will improve drastically in comparison to XY, ORAS, and SM. It's possible that we'll even go to an Alola that doesn't fucking demonize Megas, and it would treat the mechanic like any other region would. New Alola Forms for Johto Pokémon would help a bunch. If we get any new Megas and variants in the same game, I'll be happy.
 
It's nice to see that the hypothetical Sinnoh remakes are not coming to the 3DS, as DPP are still playable on the handheld system. It makes more sense to let them appear on the Switch along with Gen 8.

I'm super hyped for USM due to the way BW2 was successfully pulled off. I bet my munny that the postgame will improve drastically in comparison to XY, ORAS, and SM. It's possible that we'll even go to an Alola that doesn't fucking demonize Megas, and it would treat the mechanic like any other region would. New Alola Forms for Johto Pokémon would help a bunch. If we get any new Megas and variants in the same game, I'll be happy.
They have a perfect opportunity to introduce Alolan Celebi because of the time / dimension themes, and I'm gonna be super heartbroken if they don't, but that's none of my business.
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Do it gamefreak, do it for me.
 
Finally finding some time to leave some thoughts:

A) Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon sounds lame, unless it lives up to it's name. So I expect a Battle Frontier headed by Anabel, whose Raikou I can beat up with a Landorus or something, Move Tutors galore, more islands to explore, Super Training (because the Macho items are boring, and Evelup takes too long), and more Ultra Beasts.

B) If they are going to do this, and yes, I'm referencing the ears on Ultra Solgaleo, and that's just one aesthetic element:




Then I would kill for a new Zoids game co-developed by Game Freak and Takara Tomy.

If they are going to clearly use design aesthetics for Pokémon that are inspired by Zoids, well, you get the idea... There are quite a few species of Pokémon that could be nice bases for new Zoids if they dared. I don't care what console it is on, or what type of play style either. It's too expensive and space-consuming to collect the models anymore for me. But to collect them as bits of data, customize them, and battle with them as I would Pokémon: that would be fun.

C) Despite the cosmic coincidence between the title of SM and the theme of DPP, it should come as no surprise that they would save the remakes until Gen 8. Though I hope that they remake Platinum instead. Then again, so long as the Poké Finder and Battle Frontier is present, I actually wouldn't mind as much. And I liked the clothes for Platinum too, so expanding customization would be a nice idea, even if they are only cut and pastes from the first Gen 8 games.

This is no doubt the last hurrah for the 3DS, so I expect something with the amount of love and effort put into B2W2 that would make anyone who skipped it regret it.
 
This is no doubt the last hurrah for the 3DS, so I expect something with the amount of love and effort put into B2W2 that would make anyone who skipped it regret it.
I think it's too soon to make THAT call yet. The 3DS had a decent showing at E3 and despite the clear success of the Switch I'm still not yet convinced of it replacing the handheld market.

I'm still surprised though about how tight lipped they are being on US/UM if they plan on making that November release date. To my knowledge, Gamefreak has never delayed their PR campaign on a new game this much, and I'd be lying if I said it wasn't making me nervous. They have less than 5 months to advertise this game, and we know diddly squat about it so far.
 

Codraroll

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Anybody remember XY? Total silence for two months after the initial launch trailer.

Or what about ORAS? There was a single video saying the equivalent of "These games are going to be a thing", then weeks of silence until they released a video where Groudon and Kyogre activated their abilities. I don't think we had anything resembling an actual trailer for months.

Same with Sun/Moon. Initial trailer, then silence. Game Freak has developed a habit of announcing something and then seemingly forgetting it for a while. I guess the idea is to let fandom set itself abuzz with speculation and excitement, creating some free marketing. But since we don't know anything about USUM other than "they are set in Alola", I personally don't think there is much to be excited about yet. What specifically do I have to look forward to? How will the gameplay change? What story elements will there be? We're not just missing some pieces of the puzzle here, we barely have any pieces at all. It's impossible to tell what the big picture will be, and as such it's hard to build any sort of expectations.
 
Anybody remember XY? Total silence for two months after the initial launch trailer.

Or what about ORAS? There was a single video saying the equivalent of "These games are going to be a thing", then weeks of silence until they released a video where Groudon and Kyogre activated their abilities. I don't think we had anything resembling an actual trailer for months.

Same with Sun/Moon. Initial trailer, then silence. Game Freak has developed a habit of announcing something and then seemingly forgetting it for a while. I guess the idea is to let fandom set itself abuzz with speculation and excitement, creating some free marketing. But since we don't know anything about USUM other than "they are set in Alola", I personally don't think there is much to be excited about yet. What specifically do I have to look forward to? How will the gameplay change? What story elements will there be? We're not just missing some pieces of the puzzle here, we barely have any pieces at all. It's impossible to tell what the big picture will be, and as such it's hard to build any sort of expectations.
In complete agreement about the lack of talking points giving us barely anything to get excited about, but if we are comparing to past games...

ORAS was announced on May 7th, 2014. Pokemon X & Y on January 8th 2013. Pokemon Sun & Moon on February 26th, 2016. All of them released in November of their associated years.

All of these games had much larger windows between the initial announcement and the release date than US/UM, so Gamefreak had the time to go silent on the marketing for a while. Sure you can be silent for two months when you announce it in January for a release that November, you've got 10+ whole months to kill. That's 5 more months of development time than US/UM is going to get. Again, they only have less than 5 more months to hype this up.

Even ORAS had an extra month and the E3 trailer to really sink your teeth into by now, so we really shouldn't be comparing to the past 3DS games, as all of them had way more information by now at 5 months out from release.

What we really should be comparing to is B2W2, which was announced (in Japan) on February 26th, 2012 and released (again in Japan) on June 23rd, 2012. That's the only timetable in recent memory that compares to this, and that's not for a worldwide release. And if that's the release model they are taking cue's from, well godspeed in that they pull it off.
 
To be blunt, this alternate story or timeline is either the 5th Gen plot progression or be involving the 2 timelines done by AZ.

While it is easy to explain the sequel approach with given examples, we have not yet had a main series involving the non-mega evolution timeline. Any of you noticed that? How would that fare Alola, would it be colonized by Unova just like in real life?
 
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