Kangaskhan (OU Revamp)

Bedschibaer

NAME = FUCK
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The old analysis is terrible and looks like it has been up since 2004. The only reason to even use Kang in ou is the set described here, an Attract set is completely unviable and should not be a listed set.


[Overview]

Kangaskhan is generally outclassed by the more prominent Normal types of the tier, namely Snorlax, but it does have a niche as a Curse sweeper that is able to beat the common counters to Curse users. Decent bulk, hitting fairly hard and the ability to set up on Growl and Charm users as well as being able to underspeed opposing phazers to win those matchups, make it a good choice of an offensive Pokemon that can apply pressure to more passive teams. Yet Kangaskhan is struggling to perform as well as Snorlax as a Curse user due to the inability to soak up special hits as well. With the right support it can pose a threat though and it lets you utilize Snorlax for different roles.

[SET]
name: Curse
move 1: Curse
move 2: Return
move 3: Substitute
move 4: Roar
item: Leftovers

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Curse is the focus of the set. With one boost Kangaskhan can soak up attacks from physical and mixed threats like Snorlax, Tyranitar or Nidoking. The speed drop is actually beneficial in the matchups versus phazers because of being able to Roar them out before they can do it to you. One boost is enough to underspeed all Roar and Whirlwind users apart from Steelix. This also means that after one boost you are still outspeeding Snorlax, helping you enormously in beating it. Kangaskhan's power is decent, giving it a good chance to 2HKO Raikou, Starmie and Nidoking, as well as 2HKOing Exeggutor, Machamp and Vaporeon after Spikes. Everything else that doesn't resist Return is 3HKOed at +1. Substitute is used to block Growl and Charm users, making it impossible for them to prevent Kangaskhan from setting up. Roar is used to prevent Kangaskhan being phazed out itself after it started boosting up.


Usage Tips
========

Kangaskhan should try to utilize free turns to set up at least one Curse to get the set going, because without any boosts Kangaskhan is a real under-performer. Getting it in on a statused or resting Pokemon is a fairly safe way to boost up without being punished too hard. This should not occur before making sure, that Kangaskhan can even threaten the opposing team to begin with. Ghost types have to be removed because they wall it and can take it down fairly easily. This can be accomplished with Pursuit support. Normal resists should be weakened to speed up the Curse/Roar process and prevent Kangaskhan from being stalled out. Spikes are a good support option that is increasing the effectiveness of the set, since you will be continually shuffling the opposing team around as soon as a phazer comes in and throw out punches versus everything else. This way you can apply heavy pressure on your opponent since he can't play around you with phazing or stat reduction, which beats other Curse users. Spreading paralysis is generally good support for Curse users, but paralyzing opposing phazers can become counterproductive due to dropping their speed and giving them the possibility to phaze Kangaskhan out.

Team Options
========

Tyranitar or Umbreon provide Pursuit support and can beat Gengar and Misdreavus or wear them down in the long run so Kangaskhan can attempt to get off a sweep. Cloyster or Forretress are the best users of Spikes which are will help Kangaskhan to apply pressure on the opposing team. Toxic is a good move that pairs well with Spikes as well as phazing in general. Wearing down sturdier Pokemon will ease Kangaskhan's work as well as force opposing Pokemon to rest earlier, giving Kangaskhan opportunities to set up. Sleep inducers also pair well because they can open up opportunities for Kangaskhan to come in and start cursing. Lovely Kiss Snorlax for example can put Normal resists to sleep which Kangaskhan benefits from directly.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
===========

Earthquake is an option to hit the ghosts as well as hitting Steelix, Tyranitar and Rhydon harder. Double-Edge gives you a greater damage output but will reduce your longevity and staying power enormously which is defeating the purpose of the set. Rest is a possibility to regain health again, Sleep Talk can work as well to set up. One should be aware, that using those moves take away Kangaskhan's actual niche and make it a worse version of the other Normal types. Kangaskhan also has access to Attract which can hit a majority of the metagame, but it won't accomplish a lot apart from annoying the opponent a bit.

Checks and Counters
=============

Ghost types are the quickest answer to Kangaskhan, since it can't hit them most of the time. Gengar will be able to take it down with attacks since Kangaskhan usually lacks Rest. Misdreavus can beat it with Perish Song. Toxic Skarmory is a full stop to Kangaskhan too because it can status Kangaskhan if it used Curse on the switch and whirlwind it out if it used Substitute on the switch. Steelix can still phaze out Kangaskhan after one boost and isn't really worried about its attacks. Both of these scenarios can be prevented by Kangaskhan lowering its Speed DV, but then it also misses out on outspeeding Snorlax with one boost. Because Kangaskhan's only recovery are Leftovers hitting it with strong attacks while it is setting up will prevent it from doing much. Zapdos, Cloyster, Suicune and Reflect Raikou are bulky enough to even take hits after a curse and hit back with strong special attacks. Machamp can 2HKO Kangaskhan and outspeeds it after one Curse, but it has to watch out to not get hit by a boosted return on the switch-in. If you keep your field free of Spikes you should be able to stall out Kangaskhan with phazers like Skarmory. Any form of Status renders Kangaskhan fairly useless and will prevent a sweep.
 
Last edited:

Mr.E

unban me from Discord
is a Two-Time Past SPL Champion
"looks alright to me"

I think of myself more as an editor. Once upon a time I cared more about doing this stuff but I was between ladybugs at the time.
 

Jorgen

World's Strongest Fairy
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In the overview don't say "use Snorlax instead" because that makes it sound like Lax doesn't get used on Kanga teams.

Umbreon does not beat Misdreavus.

Spikes might be a bit overstated. I mean yeah they're good but Kanga's no better an abuser of Spikes than anything else really. In fact, because he sets up, he needs Spikes less than something like, say, Nidoking.

"Wearing down Pokemon like Misdreavus, Cloyster, Tyranitar or Rhydon which usually don't carry Rest will speed up Kangaskhan work as well as bait in Blissey or Miltank, which Kangaskhan can punish." I don't really follow. Explain it to me. How are Blissey and Miltank lured in? How is Kanga punishing two mons that can easily status it? Why are Cloyster and the Rocks especially important to wear down? (I'm not being rhetorical with these questions, I honestly want you to explain your thought process with this).

The sleep users listed are probably better for forcing Zapdos to sleep than for giving Kanga "free setup". The latter doesn't really happen with sleeping mons in GSC, and if it does, it's because you're playing the odds against ST Zapdos, not because it's legitimately free setup the way it is in BW/ORAS.

Toxic Skarm is a full stop to standard Kanga. If Kanga Curses on the switch, Skarm can Toxic before Sub can block the status. Game over for Kanga; status is a killer. If Kanga subs, then Skarm outslows with WW. Kanga can drop its Speed DV to beat this, but then you miss out on outpacing Lax at +1.
 

Bedschibaer

NAME = FUCK
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changed the first 3 ones, spikes is not mandatory support but generally good support for Kang to overcome the rather mediocre damage output and to punish your opponent switching around.

Yeah that one was kinda badly worded. Cloyster is there because it's the thing that beats kang one on one without resisting its attacks, and if it carries spin instead of boom it will be able to spin as well as take away like 60% from kang and prevent it from setting up a sub. Probably not the best thing to put in this place because other mons can do that too. The rocks are there because all the damage you will be doing to them is via spikes because you have to roar them out (unless non roar ttar, but that can quite often beat you too). Toxicing those speeds that up, but it's not especially important so i'll just replace that with a more general statement. Blissey and Miltank aren't lured in (badly worded), but they are forced in earlier when you spread toxic around. Blissey gives a free turn assuming it doesn't toxic on the switch, because it actually can't just easily status kang risking it getting a sub up. Miltank only has a chance to break a sub even without any boosts, so that's only a 30% chance to get off a para too. Let's assume this scenario - Miltank is in and uses heal bell -> Kang switches in. Miltank uses body slam, Kang gets up a sub. Now Miltank attacks again while Kang curses up. most of the time the sub won't be broken. Now Kang can sub again if miltank attacks again and will always endure 2 hits with the substitute, 3 if it curses up again. The problem is that if Miltank decides to play this game for a ~40% chance to fish for a para kang gets up boosts to a point where it will regain health again with lefties despite subbing and it fails to leave the field without kang having boosts and a sub up. Hope that explains my thought process to you, but you are right that those are probably not the most worthy things to mention here so i am going to leave it out.

I am only going to mention lk lax here specifically because it realistically hits things that aren't sleep talkers quite often and i changed the sleeper part to "can open opportunities".

Added that.
Thanks for the feedback!
 
kanga has one very unique and specific niche -- it beats defensive teams running both skarm/steelix and miltank/umbreon. it falls short if all three criteria are not met. i don't have a lot of experience with her, most of it was from watching nitro's games. he seems to make it work, but i have no idea how he gets into that position. the issue is, the opponent needs to play defensively for her to really pay off. you can't go toe-to-toe with most things, and you have issues switching into any sort of attack at all. plus you need to avoid status.

so again, the specific niche of a defensive team + defensive playstyle is where kanga is good.
 

Lavos

Banned deucer.
Bedschibaer I know this hasn't been touched in almost 4 years but it really does look fine to me, Kanga is not a Pokemon that needs much to be written about it. I think you should emphasize that this set is truly its only niche in the meta and that it requires Pursuit support and Spikes to function as anything other than a waste of time. Some of the descriptions could be a bit more polished but I will leave that to the GP folks. Just brush up the Team Options to emphasize Pursuit+Spikes and I'll QC it.
 

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