A glimpse at Crushking: A Wall "Crushing" Nidoking

Gouki

nice times all the times
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First off, the OP does a great job explaining not only what the set is capable of doing, but also the purpose that it should serve in a team. You obviously put effort into making this a quality thread. Good job!

As for the set itself, it's definitely solid, although Tyranitar is capably of doing exactly what this does, but with superior stats in literally every category. In Nidoking's defense, he does have the added advantage of being immune to electric attacks, as well as the very useful ability to absorb Toxic Spikes.

All in all, a good set for a very cool Pokemon =)
 
As for the set itself, it's definitely solid, although Tyranitar is capably of doing exactly what this does, but with superior stats in literally every category. In Nidoking's defense, he does have the added advantage of being immune to electric attacks, as well as the very useful ability to absorb Toxic Spikes.
But depending on your team, Sandstorm could potentially end up hurting you more than your opponent. So I suppose it's all relative as to what you need done.

Plus, unless the opponent has faced a Nidoking or read this topic, he gains the all too important "WTF Factor".
 
Now, you may be asking "Why Nidoking?" "Why not Ape or BOAH?" The answer is that Nidoking is immune to two very common statuses, has a great immunity, and gets a nice range of resists. In addition to that, it can also suck up Toxic Spikes.
Well, considering Tyranitar...

Defense Tier for Nidoking: 115 114.78
Defense Tier for T-Tar: 119.37 118.52

T-Tar gets a bonus of 4.25 due to Sandstorm, bringing his Sp. Defense Tier to 122.77.

"Not Very Effective" is represented with a 7.27 bonus to defense tiers. Thus, if we assume Nidoking has a resist that T-Tar doesn't have... Nidoking's Def. Tier becomes:

Nidoking + Resist: 122.27 122.03

So as far as Sp. Def goes, T-Tar is stronger than Nidoking, even if we assume that Nidoking has a resistance. In the case of a physical attack, Nidoking is 3 solid tiers above T-Tar when he resists an attack... but you're still assuming that every attack is resisted with that calculation.

Basically, Nidoking's resists only puts him on a similar defense tier as Tyranitar, not ahead of him. I think the focus should be on Nidoking's T-Wave immunity and ability to take up Toxic Spikes. Basically, the "resists" advantage is a weak advantage at best over Boah, because T-Tar's defenses are just so big that they more or less neutralize Nidoking's resist advantages.
 
Basically, the "resists" advantage is a weak advantage at best over Boah, because T-Tar's defenses are just so big that they more or less neutralize Nidoking's resist advantages.
But the point is to destroy walls. Walls like to Thunder Wave and Toxic. He's immune to electric, so that's the first, and aren't Poison types unable to be poisoned too?
 
I was thinking along the lines of Nidoking's Fighting / Rock / Bug resists, which are IMO, "nice resists" over Tyranitar's resists. At the end of the day, even though Nidoking has resists to 3 common attacks... he still can't take CB Close Combats from Heracross (which gives Heracross a 30% chance for GUTS anyway >_> ). 2-hit KO by CB Heracross Close Combat == Nidoking's resists may be nice... but his defenses don't make up for it.
 
But isn't Tyranitar 1hko'd by a Heracross' Close Combat, let alone a CB one? Besides, "CrushKing" isn't supposed to counter Heracross, it's supposed to wreck walls, which is has immunities against that Tyranitar doesn't.
 
This is just a worse Tyraniboah, maybe it has some use in UU or whatever, but it doesn't stand a chance against other "wall crushers" in OU.
 
Again, the initial post:

Now, you may be asking "Why Nidoking?" "Why not Ape or BOAH?" The answer is that Nidoking is immune to two very common statuses, has a great immunity, and gets a nice range of resists
Again, Nidoking's "nice range of resists" are not an advantage over Boah due to Nidoking's much lower defenses.
 
Nice idea actually. The reasons someone else mentioned about toxic/t-wave/toxic spikes immunity are good enough for me, and I usually just run bog-standard Choice Band with Fire Blast on the side.
 
Again, the initial post:



Again, Nidoking's "nice range of resists" are not an advantage over Boah due to Nidoking's much lower defenses.
It has those nice resists against pokes that kill Boah, that doesn't mean it's better in any way. With those stats a simple EQ or whatever kills it, try that with a subbed boah.
 
A Pokemon isn't killed by a move when it has a sub? Incredible!

The reason this has merits over Tyranitar boils down to Sandstorm immunity (without starting one), Thunder Wave immunity, Toxic immunity, and ability to soak up Toxic Spikes. It has no real place fighting Heracross, so that seems like a moot point to me; It's meant for taking on walls and to that end, it has some real advantages over other wallbreakers.
 
>_< I used this EXACT set in my Hail team more than 6 months ago. The truth is, this set looks better than it actually is. Nidoking is one of my favorite Pokemon and thus have tried countless times to take advantage of his amazing resistances and vast moveset.

However, it is extremely hard, if not impossible, to successfully utilize all of Nidokings advantages. Sure it can OHKO-2HKO some of the most common walls in D/P, but it requires the use of Life Orb and split attacking EVs. This makes him not only frail, but relatively slow. Considering he is only relying on his resistances to come in, he won't ever sweep.

Nidoking serves one amazing purpose: to wreak havoc in the UU metagame. This is where his potential truly shines. Its unfortunate that this cool Pokemon can't compete with the standerds of OU. If only he kept Lovely Kiss, :(.
 
But the point is to destroy walls. Walls like to Thunder Wave and Toxic. He's immune to electric, so that's the first, and aren't Poison types unable to be poisoned too?
that's actually a very good point. ever switch into your wall breaker just to be t-waved? man i hate that and it's so common. maybe this will be decent with some good wish support.
 
i think thunder would be decent on it in the same spot as fire blast is for hurting bulky waters that like swicthing in on it. the lower accucary could be a pain but the with para chance its still worth it
 
I like the depth gone into here, and think its a solid option, but Dusknoir is going WoW it which hurts it greatly, so it doesn't really 'crush that'.
 
There is no clear cut best, but what I am trying to say is that Toxic immunity and Twave immunity are two of the best things a wallbreaker should have, next to super effective moves to kill the walls that is.
 

Raj

CAP Playtesting Expert
I don't believe anyone has yet mentioned the fact that Nido doesn't take sandstorm damage, which although not too special, allows it to stay in a little longer. In fact it works quite well with Tyranitar, being as the dino is immune to Psychic, however Nido is dead meat against opposing T-Tars. I've been using CrushKing sice Light suggested it on Shoddy a couple of weeks ago and thus far has proved successful. The only true threat (of walls of course) has been Cresselia (who can be taken care of with T-Tar, also giving it the oppurtunity to set up a Dragon Dance on the switch). Boah cannot take Gliscor or Hippowdon, a feat which Nido does with ease in addition to destroying all Steels other than Metagross.

3N3MY, note that this moveset and spread is not designed to sweep anything other than the common wall. It does outspeed most of these threats, unless an abnormal spread is used to give it speed.

In addition, every Poke who tries stat boosting, barring D-Dancing Gyara and Ninjask eats an at least one of his moves. Many users feel the need to Dragon Dance/ Swords Dance their Dragonite, Salamence, Garchomp, believing Nido to not be a threat and therefore a free setup and fall. Dusknoirs take EQ, Umbreon Megahorn.

That's about it. I'd run Rivalry in Shoddy for the fact that Tyranitar can take care of Blissey and Cresselia, but otherwise you may run into trouble and fall short some damage.
 
A Pokemon isn't killed by a move when it has a sub? Incredible!

The reason this has merits over Tyranitar boils down to Sandstorm immunity (without starting one), Thunder Wave immunity, Toxic immunity, and ability to soak up Toxic Spikes. It has no real place fighting Heracross, so that seems like a moot point to me; It's meant for taking on walls and to that end, it has some real advantages over other wallbreakers.
That BS, triple kick with a CB kills tyranitar.

SS immunity means great sp def with already ok def, great sp atk, atk, hp. And yes, a pokemon behind a sub with ggreat HP etc. doesn't faint, that's why you should use boah.
 
That BS, triple kick with a CB kills tyranitar.

SS immunity means great sp def with already ok def, great sp atk, atk, hp. And yes, a pokemon behind a sub with ggreat HP etc. doesn't faint, that's why you should use boah.
Have you ever seen triple kick used in competitive play?

In any case, do understand that the stats aren't the main point of contentment, instead it is the fact that Nidoking can be in a sandstorm without causing it, be immune to Twave/Bolt, absorb Toxic spikes and Toxic.

Most other wall breakers are ruined if hit by a Twave and their ability to live is greatly ruined by poison, the thing is that Nidoking doesn't have those problems.
 
I should probably have rephrased that, this gen the usage of Triple Kick on Hitmontop is a rarity, thanks to other sets made possible by Technician.
 
I don't believe anyone has yet mentioned the fact that Nido doesn't take sandstorm damage, which although not too special, allows it to stay in a little longer. In fact it works quite well with Tyranitar, being as the dino is immune to Psychic, however Nido is dead meat against opposing T-Tars.
I fail to see how other T-tars kill nido when he outspeeds and massively hurts them with Earthquake.
 

Raj

CAP Playtesting Expert
RaikouLover, many battlers opt for Jolly Tyranitar who has 243 speed, while the spread on Nido gives it 227. Therefore Nido goes second unless you sacrifice some attack for speed (which is completely viable if you decide on Pivalry over Poison Point)
 

Bologo

Have fun with birds and bees.
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I should probably have rephrased that, this gen the usage of Triple Kick on Hitmontop is a rarity, thanks to other sets made possible by Technician.
That's not completely true. Triple Kick gets boosted by Technician as well, so people still use it on their technician sets on occasion, since it does get 90 base power STAB if all 3 kicks hit.
 
I've never actually seen a Hitmontop this gen with Triple Kick, but I'm willing to admit that I'm wrong and that they do carry it.
 

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